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Post by emm8 on Aug 8, 2022 16:35:23 GMT -5
Coach I agree 100% Crazy decisions like hiring IRS agents etc is based on a tie breaking vote we have a worker shortage and to take potential employees to harass people make 25000 to 100000 dollars is Idiotic "to harass people make 25000 to 100000 dollars"You're missing about 3 zeroes on each of those amounts (must have been a typo in your haste ). Probably meant $2,500,0000 to $100,000,000. If you're making between " 25000 to 100000 dollars", you've got little to worry about. From a Washington Post article (but you can get it from most any other publications): "The bill, known as the Inflation Reduction Act, would put $80 billion toward beefing up the IRS, in line with liberals’ long-term goals to strengthen tax collection and enforcement on corporations and high-income earners, while relieving low-income taxpayers of cumbersome and frightening audits." Job #1 is probably to put their best guy on finishing up Frumps 10 year old audit. LOL
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Post by hs on Aug 8, 2022 19:26:51 GMT -5
It was just recently posted in MoneyWatch that the IRS audits poorer people at 5 times the rate of everyone else their analysis shows, so please spare me trying to tell us that the liberal’s long term goals is to “tax the rich”. Common sense says corporations and high income earners have the money to hire lawyers and know the tax code in and out. Why is it whenever the government wants money they tax the hell out of the middle class? Because that’s where the easy money is. Biden ran on taxing the rich but the middle class is about to take it right in the shorts
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Post by stones on Aug 8, 2022 19:41:35 GMT -5
Well I hope your correct IMO They are coming after the little guy They can alter many things I actually go through this Its a pain in the ass
HS I thought we witnessed everything until now Mar A Lago raided by the FBI Crazy times
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Post by baldwintrack on Aug 8, 2022 20:00:53 GMT -5
I certainly don’t like Trump but I can do without the made for TV raid. Does nothing to promote the case of removing him from the public light. Which is what the goal should be.
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Post by emm8 on Aug 8, 2022 21:45:59 GMT -5
It was just recently posted in MoneyWatch that the IRS audits poorer people at 5 times the rate of everyone else their analysis shows, so please spare me trying to tell us that the liberal’s long term goals is to “tax the rich”. Common sense says corporations and high income earners have the money to hire lawyers and know the tax code in and out. Why is it whenever the government wants money they tax the hell out of the middle class? Because that’s where the easy money is. Biden ran on taxing the rich but the middle class is about to take it right in the shorts From the GAO (Government Accounting Office): (see the attached at the bottom) Audit %'s by Income Strata for 2019$1 to <$25k .40% (4 tenths of 1%) The reason for the higher % for lower incomes has to do with the EITC (Earned Income Tax Credit) $25k to <$200k .17% $200k to <$500k .17% $500k to <$1m .53% $1m to <$5m 1.02% >$5m 2.53% 77% of all tax returns that claim the EITC (which applies only to the very lowest income earners with dependents) get audited, thus inflating the overall numbers for the lowest income level. So yes, to some degree your statement is correct, but it's not 5 times. It's actually 2.35 times, and explained by the emphasis (for whatever reason) on reviewing returns claiming the EITC. Apparently, many people incorrectly apply or abuse the credit's application?From the attached report "However, the audit rate for lower-income taxpayers claiming the Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) was higher than average. IRS officials explained that EITC audits require relatively few resources and prevent ineligible taxpayers from receiving the EITC." These EITC returns that get audited are pretty simple, and spotted quickly by computer, and can be resolved easily with just a couple correspondences and receipts. Also, it claims that not enough agents allows the rich (and corporations) to skate by because of the complexity of those audits, and the time it takes to do them (ie...Frump's). There ain't enough agents (particularly the agents with the knowledge, experience, and training), and not enough hours in a day to force the "Richie Riches" of the world to pay their "fair" share. The lower income audits are fairly simple, and can be done by entry level staff. It's not that the poorest are being unfairly audited, but that the top aren't being audited enough, and thus the 80 billon in the bill for more staff. That's why the "Richie Riches" fought it so hard. Will it pay for itself? IDK Probably won't, but if it brings in more tax revenue great. And it'll, at the very least, add a couple thousand more jobs. Some light reading for ya': www.gao.gov/products/gao-22-104960
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Post by hs on Aug 9, 2022 6:30:30 GMT -5
5% or 2.35% that’s fine. Not my analysis it was MoneyWatch so take it up with them not me. I’m sure though 10 groups would come up with 10 different percentages so that’s fine. Still goes to mine and stones point that lower income people are audited more. Where we and others differ on is where we believe these new IRS agents will be used. Under Obama the IRS was caught targeting conservative groups. What has changed in any Democrats thinking that would make me believe that won’t start doing things like that again? If anything the divisiveness has gotten worse
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Post by emm8 on Aug 9, 2022 11:07:25 GMT -5
I'm with you on the statistical analysis. “There are three types of lies -- lies, damn lies, and statistics.” ... As to "lower income people are audited more": I didn't know any of the actual "statistics" about audits until you piqued my interest with the "5x" you threw out there. I just thought that seemed a tad high, and decided to see what I could find. Had what I found supported what you claimed, I probably wouldn't have responded to anything in your post. I also wanted to use something fairly official, which was why I used the 2019 GAO document, as opposed to a CNN (or Fox News report), or a Washington Post (or Wall Street Journal) article. It appears "lower income people are audited more", but the report I used for support addressed that issue. Seemed to be a valid reason for the discrepancy. Might take further analysis to decide if fair, or not...but I'm not riled up enough (actually not riled up at all, but you get the gist) to go the distance on that topic. As to "Where we and others differ on is where we believe these new IRS agents will be used". And, "If anything the divisiveness has gotten worse", the prejudging that the bills resources will be used for purposes other than what is stated is part of the divisiveness your opining about. FTR, the IRS in 2019 (and currently) is headed by Trump appointee Charles P. Rettig. You've made up your mind that the bill will be used for nefarious purposes. I can't get myself riled up about stuff happening without proof that it already happened. And finally, in researching my "statistics" I happened to find this on google, but didn't bother to read it (but it sure made me chuckle). I just saw the title "IRS Chief Faces Questions Over Audits of Trump Foes" If you choose to read it, let me know what you think. www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2022/07/07/trump-irs-rettig-audit/
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Post by Downriver on Aug 9, 2022 12:16:08 GMT -5
Having been in tax law my entire career and spending tons of time dealing with the IRS, I can unequivocally state that lower income people are not targeted. Even though they have a higher percentage of audits it is directly linked to the misuse of the EITC credit. The majority are honest misuse of the tax credit while a small percentage are actually people trying to screw the government. 95% of these issues are solved by a couple of letters back and forth and never actually result in a full blown audit. Another reason is that most of these returns are not complicated and the errors are picked up by a computer scan and not an actual agent reviewing them.
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Post by baldwintrack on Aug 9, 2022 17:56:42 GMT -5
Rep Scott Perry out of York had his phone seized by the FBI today as part of the 1/6 investigation. Somebody is talking.
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Post by baldwintrack on Aug 10, 2022 20:05:41 GMT -5
Was just talking to a buddy at the bar during dinner about what strange times we are living in. Democrats want to defund local police and not prosecute people for violent crimes or drug related offenses. But talk about a racially motivated hate crime and throw everything I just said away.
Republicans want to defund the FBI and IRS and limit oversight to investigations from most federal entities. But talk about investigating people tied to democrat politicians throw everything I said away.
Both sides have something in common! They’re trying to protect and appeal to people more likely to vote for them. Neither side is pro law and order or anti law enforcement. They’ve actually just decided to each have completely contradictory double standards.
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Post by emm8 on Aug 12, 2022 15:26:40 GMT -5
Not to belabor the point on the IRS that we were volleying over during the past week or so, but I just happened to run across this statement embedded in an article on Yahoo about something Elon Musk put out on Twitter about getting audited every year. I don't use Twitter, and could care less about what Elon Musk says or does (and ain't really sure why I took the bait and clicked on it), but this statement was at the very end of the article in Business Insider, and fit my point(s) I was supporting. ""The IRS has fewer front-line, experienced examiners in the field than at any time since World War II, and fewer employees than at any time since the 1970s," IRS Commissioner Charles Rettig said in a letter to the Senate in early August. With the funding package, "enhanced IT systems and taxpayer service will actually mean that honest taxpayers will be better able to comply with the tax laws, resulting in a lower likelihood of being audited and a reduced burden on them," he added."
"Insider's Juliana Kaplan reported that the IRS is understaffed, underfunded, and backed up with unprocessed tax returns."Remember IRS Commissioner Charles Rettig is a Trump appointee. www.yahoo.com/finance/news/elon-musk-said-taxes-audited-141445256.html
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Post by hs on Sept 23, 2022 8:48:03 GMT -5
Didn’t think I would see the Dow under 30,000 again but here we are as people now are fearing a recession. Just gotta love what Biden and the Democrats are doing to this country
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Post by baldwintrack on Sept 23, 2022 14:50:48 GMT -5
I think it can be a really fair argument we’ve had the worst two certainly two of the worst 3 (JamesBuchannon) presidents in American history back to back.
I blame us. Not the political parties. We are attracted to scum without ethics or substance. We have gotten what we’ve voted for.
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Post by stones on Sept 23, 2022 19:57:53 GMT -5
HS It pains me everyday what Americans gave up in 2020 Anyone thinking this garbage wasn't gonna happen is pretty much Idiotic IMO I'm actually done arguing about it on here
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Post by baldwintrack on Sept 23, 2022 20:12:09 GMT -5
If the last guy wasn’t a career criminal who scared half the people in the country to death with ridiculous rhetoric maybe Americans would have voted for him.
You can have your opinions on Trump but a lot of people are happy he’s gone in spite of what has happened. That’s how reprehensible he is. And that’s not a media creation. He earned his reputation.
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